On Welsh Bans and PP, Plus a Pic of the Seedlings

I was not intent upon talking about Welsh craziness or the UK Government declaration of intent to bring in plain packaging. Both of these subjects have been covered more than adequately elsewhere. What changed my mind was an item in the comments from my piece about ‘The Sense of Smell’. I remarked that I had seen an advert or something which said: “If you can smell it, it is probably harming you”. Rose put me right. It seems that I must have seen it via some comment from Rose. Anyway, the statement came from here:


ASH’s Smoking in Condos and Apartments Information.
Nonsmokers living in condominiums and apartment buildings who are bothered or made ill by drifting tobacco smoke can now fight back. Yes, now that people are beginning to realize that drifting tobacco smoke can cause lung cancer and heart attacks in nonsmokers, more and more of them are becoming concerned about tobacco smoke in their condos or apartment buildings . Despite the best modern filtration systems, many of the carcinogenic and other dangerous components of tobacco smoke can be recirculated through a building’s ventilation system and into nonsmokers’ apartments . These dangerous chemicals can also seep in above or below an apartment door, through poorly sealed walls, and in many other ways .

If you can smell it, it could be killing you!

And even if you can’t smell it, many of these cancer-causing chemicals can never-the-less be entering your lungs .
Moreover, many people who has asthma, hay fever, allergies, emphysema, sinusitis, and many other conditions can be severely irritated by even small amounts of drifting tobacco smoke. And those with a prior history of heart problems, who are overweight, have a high cholesterol level, or are simply elderly may be at increased risk of a sudden and deadly heart attack brought on by drifting tobacco smoke .


We should not be surprised that legislators are passing stupid laws. What is the standard of evidence? Clearly, from the above, it is not very high. In fact, as is clearly indicated, the standard of evidence is shite. Any shite will do, no matter how preposterous.

Chris Snowden has details of the Chantler Report here:


If you want to read the report itself, it is available here:


I haven’t had time to read the full thing yet, but I was struck by this sentence in paragraph 5:

As a paediatrician, I began the Review with the knowledge that most smokers take up the habit as children and that smoking is both highly addictive and extremely harmful to health. However, I had no prior view on the efficacy or desirability of standardised packaging as a policy measure to control tobacco consumption.” [My bold] Eh?? I thought that Chantler’s brief was to examine the health effects of PP and not its effects upon control of tobacco consumption.Control of tobacco consumption is really easy – JUST BAN IT!

I don’t doubt Chantler’s honesty and integrity, but that statement is a bit like Judge Nimmo Smith, in the McTear Case, beginning his ‘Opinion’ with the phrase: “Now, before I start, I must reveal that I personally am a lifelong smoker and I don’t believe all this shit about smoking causing lung cancer. So now I’ll start to rip the evidence of tobacco control to bits”

There was also another statement which struck me, as quoted by Chris Snowden:

On the issue of counterfeiting he, again, misses the point. “In my view,” he writes, “the argument that standardised packaging makes it materially easier or cheaper for criminals to produce counterfeit packaging is not supported by the evidence I have seen.” [My bold]

Right – so what evidence has he seen? How did he go about finding the evidence, or did he rely upon someone to show him the evidence? If no one showed him the evidence, then he would not have seen any. Further, why is he talking about counterfeiting at all? That was not in his brief.

If it is true that the Government asked him to review the evidence that PP would have health effects, then he should have stuck to that brief. That is, ‘is there evidence, here and now, that the design of the packets would stop people smoking?’ Clearly, it would affect some people, but the question is, how many?

I also find it odd that the Government (by which I mean the politicians and not the Zealots) has rushed out a statement. It certainly seems that it has not given itself much time to consider the report.


But we should not be surprised, as the ‘evidence’ as proclaimed by ASH USA shows us. Any old shite will do. What it shows to me is that politicians are getting further and further out of their depth. It is their own fault, since they themselves have contributed to the proliferation of NGOs and sock-puppet ‘charities’ – to say nothing of the Fascist State known as the EUSSR.

I wonder why it is that our elected representatives are so terrified of the Medical Establishment? How many votes does the ME control? I wonder what would happen if the Cabinet decided that no part of student fees should be used to fund research departments of Universities? And why has it not already so decided? Why should students pay for tobacco control research?


Eh! A report has just this minute appeared on the BBC news! Including the statement from the junior health minister! According to the BBC, the introduction of PP is now a foregone conclusion. And upon what is this further advance of fascism based? Well, as we have seen in the McTear Case, it is the ‘miasma’ of junk science. Chantler himself appeared, sounding off about hundreds of thousands of ‘deaths by choc…. sorry …. smoking’. The New World Government, directed by the ‘honest brokers’ of the Medical Establishment, is around the corner. If ever there was a recipe for civil war on a world-wide scale, this is it.

But we should not let these things bother us. Even though it is disappointing that such fascist uses of power are happening, we must be aware that modern communications can fore-shorten the effects. The position at this time is very close to prohibition, except that the prohibition is not dissimilar to the prohibition of cannabis. The prohibition takes the form of ‘not being visible’ rather than ‘being banned’. It is a King James 1 prohibition by price, but not for ‘the better sort’ of people. That is precisely where the Government is heading – prohibition by price for the poorer people, but freedom for the better off, aka ‘the better sort’.

Is not minimum pricing of alcohol the same thing? These prohibitions are not even as genuine as the USA Prohibition of Alcohol of the early 1900s. They are prohibitions based upon the standards of three hundred years ago.

Does that not tell us something about politics today? No wonder that we rarely hear the Health Secretary himself say anything, and that we see his minions, junior ministers, reading from the Zealots’ brief in the Commons. The politicians have lost control altogether. They have no idea what to do. No idea at all. Thus, they can only follow the instructions from the Zealots.


I read today that one of the major tobacco companies is moving production from Australia to Indonesia. I forget which and it is very late. I doubt that the BBC will feature the loss of jobs in Australia which will result. It seems that the company involved (Japan International?) said that PP has rendered its products indistinguishable from any old junk. But what is more important as I see it, is: “Who will operate the systems designed to collect duty?” If all the major tobacco companies withdraw manufacturing from Australia, who will collect the duties? the system will have to revert to seventeenth century practices of duties being levied upon imports. But what sort of vast organisation will be required to check and implement the imposition of duties at ports?



Enough. Here is a pic of my seedlings:

2014-04-03 22.40.29

The pic is not very bright, but it will do. What I have done is thin out the seedlings to two per cell of the propagator. Also, as recommended, I have topped up the compost up to the bottom of the leaves. There are tiny hairs on the stalks of the seedlings which will become roots as time passes.

Looking good so far.







8 Responses to “On Welsh Bans and PP, Plus a Pic of the Seedlings”

  1. Harleyrider1978 Says:

    Schuman’s Expert Witnesses Testify in Secondhand Smoke Trial

    The plaintiff’s expert witnesses spoke up on day three of David Schuman’s case against his housing cooperative, Greenbelt Homes, Inc. (GHI), for its failure to prohibit the nuisance created by his townhome neighbors, the Popovics’, secondhand smoke.

    Courtroom and Plaintiff’s Townhome Register Similar Carcinogen Levels

    But, an incident from Repace’s testimony Thursday came back into play Friday during cross examination. Goecke pointed out that on Thursday, while demonstrating the carcinogen monitor, Repace had measured the concentration of carcinogens in the court room — which is in a smoke-free building — and the amount he recorded there was similar to what Repace had reported recording in Schuman’s townhome in July of 2011.


    As you can see even in a smokefree courtroom the same so called levels were read in Schumans own Kitchen in his house! The so called scientist was none other than a fellow prohibitionist and JUNK SCIENTIST,Tornado Repace!

    Talk about being laughed out of court……………….btw these prohibitionists create whats called ”risk assesment studies” Purely fictional and nothing more than statistical magic to create fear and bigotry against smokers!

  2. Harleyrider1978 Says:

    The Schumans lived next door to Repace’s son in law!

  3. Harleyrider1978 Says:

    Its fixing to come to a resounding CRASH for the Nazis worldwide!

    • Junican Says:

      The trouble is, cousin, that they keep getting away with it: witness also the McTear Case.

  4. smokingscot Says:

    The company is Philip Morris, makers of Marlboro but without a popular RYO brand. Seems it’s suffering the fate of all premium brands as people trade down to cheaper.

    The report comes from an Aussie source but (so far as I can tell) only relates to their factory in the Netherlands. (Also reported on the Bloomberg TV ticker).


    May be related in part to people like this, who explains how tobacco control can morph and makes a huge issue elsewhere in her blog about the fact the Netherlands is a massive exporter of tobacco.


    • Junican Says:

      That may be so, ss. And yet the report that I read referred to transferring production to Indonesia. Having said that, the report that I read was not an official one. The writer could have been confused.

      Hang on – more news here:


      “Philip Morris to close Australia cigarette factory”

      “The company said Australia’s regulation regarding cigarette production was a factor in its decision.

      Philip Morris said all cigarette production for the Australian market would be moved to its plant in South Korea.”

  5. smokingscot Says:

    I stand resolutely corrected J.

    Looked at their 3 year share price. Seems investors have warmed to them becoming a little more proactive – and doing share buybacks doesn’t harm either.


    • Junican Says:

      No worries, ss. You advise me – I advise you. That is what the net is about. Politicians seem to have a ‘loop’ which excludes reality.

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